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Court Of Lore
Ep. 48 - Justice League: Mortal Pt. 1
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The Meanwhile crew continues their "Comic Book Movies That Could Have Been" Series as Chris, Saba, Kristina, and Frank take a look back at George Miller's - Justice League: Mortal, if it wasn't for an untimely Hollywood writers strike, DC may have beat Marvel Studios' Avengers to the punch on team up comic book movies. (Yes, X-Men was first. But it wasn't a Marvel Studios film.) Drawing from some of DC's most beloved Justice League comic books, George Miller's vision for the Justice League was ambitious to the say the least.
Join us as we tell the tale of the Justice League movie that might have been!
Here the exciting conclusion here in Part 2 - https://www.buzzsprout.com/1190102/8385702
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Welcome back to another exciting episode. And meanwhile, back on the podcast.
SPEAKER_01I'm Frank McGuire.
SPEAKER_03I'm Christina Didumas. I'm Sabamir.
SPEAKER_01I'm Chris Subana. Welcome, welcome. Today we're going to be doing another edition of our series on comic book movies that could have been.
SPEAKER_05Yep. We're going to be continuing that series. As you know, if you're a listener, you probably caught our Daredevil episode, uh The Man Without Fear. Uh part two is coming out soon, so guys keep an eye out for that. But today, Chris, what do we got?
SPEAKER_01So this time we have a uh we're jumping into DC, and it's this project that um that would have started off everything for DC. This was slated for 2007, early 2000s. It's called Justice League Mortal. And what's special about this, it's for me at least, it's it's a George Miller project, and it seems to be very, very ambitious. And like I said, this is this would have predated everything that the DC universe would have done. This project was inspired by the GLA Tower of Babel and Superman Sacrifice, which uh which I think like led up to Infinite Crisis, which is really cool. Uh as you know, like these movies didn't make it past production, but this spawned uh one of my favorite DC animated movies, which is uh Justice League Doom.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, it would have been fun to compare not only this movie once it came out, but to the comic book, especially with the countermeasures that Batman was using in Justice League Doom in the comic book, and also obviously within this particular movie, uh, if it had ever made it to production. Now, not a lot of people know this, but there's actually a documentary coming out about Justice League Mortal. It apparently sparked a lot of interest from a fellow nerd, podcaster, YouTuber, a guy from a site, I think, called Geek Tyrant. And he's actually in the process of doing a documentary about it. So without further ado, let's jump into this thing.
SPEAKER_01Alright, so let's get into it. So the project in question this week is um is a movie that was set to be released in 08-09. So i anybody keeping count, this is before any any Justice League movie. So this would have been the first Justice League movie to be released. And it was supposed to be headed by George Miller, written by Kieran Mulrooney and Michelle Mulrooney. And somebody run them through the cast before we get into it. Sure.
SPEAKER_05So we had Army Hammer playing Batman slash Bruce Wayne. We had DJ Cortana playing Superman. Chris, I love how you did this. Superman, Cal L, and Clark Kent. I love when people use Cal L. I love it. So DJ Cortana as Superman, Cal L, and Clark Kent. Megan Gale as Wonder Woman, Adam Brody as The Flash. That's my uh stop swooning, Saba. Stop swooning.
SPEAKER_02I know that literally my middle school diary. I had a photo of him in it and I would open it up and just like look at him, I guess. I don't really know.
SPEAKER_05Um, Hugh Keyes Byrne as Martian Manhunter. Now, Hugh Keys Byrne was the guy that played Immorton Joe in Mad Max Fury Road.
SPEAKER_01He has to be in the movie with George Miller. Always has to have uh always have to have uh that guy in it.
SPEAKER_02He's got his he's he's got his regulars.
SPEAKER_05His regulars. Yeah, exactly. Teresa Palmer as Tal Yelaghool, uh Zoe Kazan as Iris Allen. I have no idea what what she looks like.
SPEAKER_02Um the F-word, she's in the big sick. Uh she's Paul Dano's partner. They write stuff together. She's really cool. She's a good actress.
SPEAKER_05Was she the girl that was like with Daniel Radcliffe in the F-word?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Like the love interest. Oh, she's cute as shit. Okay, cool. Yeah, she is. Santiago Cabrera as Aquaman and Canadian Homie, Jay Barrakel as Maxwell Lord, and Homie of Homies, Common as Juan Stewart, the Green Lantern, and then and then the uh rest in peace, Aton Yelchin playing Wally West.
SPEAKER_02So right at the gate, this is a crazy cast. I really do think this cast is pretty I there's something there's definitely highlights in here for me, I think for sure. Um, and the fact is like they were all casted, like movie that was in pre-production. Yes, like this isn't dream casting.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, no, it was it was totally casted. Everybody was already kind of in the process of preparation. George Miller was playing mind games with the cast, apparently, trying to prepare them for the roles. Like he was fucking with Army Hammer's Head, intentionally scheduling meetings without him and having conference calls without him, so he'd get all suspicious, just like the Batman. And yeah, seriously. Well, you know, directors like to, you know, they have their methods, right? They have their methods, and some of them are a little bit far is you know, pretty out there, and some of them are obviously a little bit more um, you know, normal, but uh and it's usually the most extreme like super extreme. Yeah, I agree with that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, they have to be eccentric people, right? But I thought it was funny because it took Army Hammer like a little while for him to even realize that he was in a game.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it did.
SPEAKER_03It took him like a few months.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it did, it did, yeah, it did. Like this would have been the first movie, b first like superhero team up movie before anything, before Avengers, before I think there there may have been like a smaller, smaller like title before, but this would have been before anything.
SPEAKER_05Yep.
SPEAKER_01So if if you guys are familiar with with Tower of Babel, it's this is where Batman essentially creates the these like contingency plans against members of the Just League because he's he's a crazy old kook who doesn't trust his own his own team, but they get stolen in in Tower of Babel. They get stolen by uh I think Rosal Ghoul. I think I want to say Razal Gul steals it. We'll we'll get into that uh uh later.
SPEAKER_05But did you just call Batman a crazy old coot? Uh is he not?
SPEAKER_02He is very paranoid. You know, I will give you that.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, you know, okay, so I see Batman as kind of the the ultimate, you know, tactician, pragmatist, just being prepared for the absolute worst if it was to happen. That's how I see it. What do you call that? What do you call that? That's crazy old. No, it's not directly.
SPEAKER_03Imagine if it did that to your friends. Like, imagine you were working on a project with some colleagues and you like dug a dirt on them just in case they went to age.
SPEAKER_02Like you knew all their weaknesses. Well, imagine finding that file. Like, you know, somehow really hates it when you leave dirty dishes on the desk.
SPEAKER_01And that's no, I'm not actually gonna use this dirt, but if if she makes me use it, I will.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, cups everywhere.
SPEAKER_05Plus, plus, in Tower of Babel, like in the comic book, from what I can remember, you know, it's an amazing story. This was Mark Morrison's JLA. And this run of JLA is is it's uh you know, it lives on in infamy. It like every Justice League fan looks at this run of JLA as the standard for Justice League stories at this point. And Mark Wade was the writer on this book on on the on the on the Tower of Babel miniseries, and it's it's fucking fantastic. And you know, Chris said go and watch Justice League Doom, and I totally recommend that as well. But you got to read this comic book as well because yeah, the countermeasures that get that get put into play by Batman against the rest of the Justice League are completely different um in in a couple different uh instances um in the comic book than say the Justice League Doom movie. And I think that's also gonna carry over into this into this movie plot, um, if I'm not correct.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I actually like wanted to take each contingency and sure. Like I'm not I'm not like one for comparing, even though I do we do it a lot in this podcast, but I think it would it might be really fun to like compare the three different versions of all of each contingency against the the members of the league. And I I I have them all listed out, so I I want to hear your your thoughts on sure on which which one do you think would work and what what you guys would do. But uh but before we get before we get into it, I just wanted to like ask you guys how this because this movie isn't just like Avengers where they all meet up for a for a common thread. This is like in fighting, this is like uh Captain America Civil War, yep, um type movie. And it as a first outing for a team up movie, how uh and led by remember like the this is led by George Miller, so it would have his like kind of mad maxi, like uh like um completely ingrained uh um uh storytelling because because uh this is the thing I love about George Miller is that like he writes a story and you feel like you've been watching his movies forever because it's so complete in in all these little details. What do you guys like? How would you have taken this project if it actually left the ground?
SPEAKER_02I think that it's definitely ambitious because if you're a fan of the comics, you're a fan of these characters, like at this age, like I would have been had seen the Justice League TV show and everything else, and you know, this movie, like said, it was gonna be like right in the thick of it. No origin stories, no nothing. So I would for sure want to see it, but would it have a mass public appeal in that case? Like w was this the time like you know, thinking of the time frame were superhero movies the thing. I think the cast might have pulled people in though, just like the cast itself. But I guess a lot of these people have made their their names later in the day than than that. But I would definitely be there to see it. I I do think that I wonder, because like the main the the top three, like everyone knows Wonder Woman, Batman, Superman. Those are the three that everyone knows, right? The flash and everything else. I wonder, yeah, I just wonder like the math appeal, what it would what it would be, especially with the climate not really being prime for superhero movies.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, you know, Saba, you know, the word that you chose, ambitious, I think, is perfect because this would definitely would have been, you know, an exercise of ambition. Like this is something that is obviously being driven by uh, you know, a vision that George Miller has put together from some of the more popular JLA stories that were available or sorry, that were that were produced in Grant Morrison's run on JLA. And uh, you know, I don't, you know, I can see why they used it. I can see why they went with the Tower of Babel because it is a compelling story. Um, and I think and I think it takes Batman, which is a character that's very familiar to a lot of people, and a character that is identifiable with a lot of people. It he puts him in the spotlight. Like making him making him a you know protagonist slash antagonist in the story is a good way to kind of say that this is more of a Batman driven movie than say a Justice League movie. And I think that would have kind of played well in the in uh you know with the mainstream. I think that would have played a lot better at the mainstream. That's my take.
SPEAKER_03Um, yeah, I think I think the movie would have had an audience because uh audiences would have already been familiar with the old Superman movies and the old Batman movies. And I think there was even well, Wonder Woman was a TV show and lots of people loved her. So I I think that yeah, I think the audience would have been there. And definitely the story is compelling, and the fact that it was directed by George Miller, he would he would have been popular. So I definitely think there would have been a draw for it. And I don't know, it sounds like a great plot. Like I think this would have been a good idea.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, I think it would have been a good movie too, for sure. I think they were trying to do what a studio should do when they have a comic book franchise on their hands. It's go back to the source material, find the stuff that was really popular, take that content, and then put it into a cinematic form. And I think that they picked the the right story to do that. You know, this was a very popular run, like I said, in JLA, and it was one of the more popular miniseries, and so popular that DC decided to adapt it into their animated film universe. So I don't see this going bad. Like it may have had trouble from uh from from from a from a box office sales standpoint when it comes to the mainstream audience, but I think that the the DC faithful would have been there in Drows.
SPEAKER_02So one thing I also think though is if this movie like you know came out and was successful at this time, it would definitely would have changed the landscape of the MCU as well. Oh, for sure. There would be like a speed up to get to this yes sort of yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they'd be the one like healing healing DC. Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_02Cause what 'cause what MCU did was they had solo movies for everyone and then kind of have everyone in Avengers. But then I guess with the what like they were doing was they were creating this Justice League movie, and then in my head, and and I think what they probably would have done is created these solo movies off the first movie and then have them spread out. So it it's just a different method, which I don't think either one is wrong really in in itself, but it definitely would have changed them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think like I feel like Avengers had way more momentum, obviously, because they had all these standalone movies and they were all just coalescing into this like this this like uh more of an event than than a movie, really. And with this one wouldn't have had uh the same traction. Like I suspect that this movie wouldn't have done well, but it would have like bec become a cult classic immediately, right? And all and then like it would gain traction over time and propel like DC universe to like uh uh unthinkable heights, you know what I mean? On release, I don't think it would have done as well as Avengers uh did because that was unmissable. And here it's kind of like this this like weird niche uh topic, but I think it's it's way more ambitious and way more and way more like all in, I guess, than than Avengers is. It's it's like unthinkable. Like you're doing the Avengers like Captain America Civil War as a first movie. That's so ballsy, it's so good, it's so good.
SPEAKER_02But anyway, that's no it is that's that's a good comparison.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, um, let's get into uh into the plot. Like we'll we'll we'll run you guys down uh on the plot. So um you can see how how like messy this movie is. It's important to note that in this movie uh the characters know of each other, but a lot of them are meeting each other for the first time. It won't really show up when we when we uh summarize everything, but yeah, just keep in mind like there's no Justice League yet. They're all independent, they're they're all independent heroes, and they all just kind of come together in the plot.
SPEAKER_03Okay, so that's my favorite phase of superheroes. Yeah, me too, actually.
SPEAKER_01So uh we open up with with Batman using this this satellite called Brother Eye, and it's this like spy network that he has he's got going. And and it's important to note that in Doom he doesn't have this, it's it's something else. So it's like it's I think I'm pretty sure Frank, correct me if I'm wrong. Is Brother Eye in Tower of Babel? Oh or is it new new to this script?
SPEAKER_05No, I think it's new to this script. I think what they're trying to convey is that Batman has been watching the Justice League, like the Justice League members without their knowledge for like so long, and that's why he has these contingencies. I think they're trying to, because their Justice League isn't formed yet, that's what this story's about, is bringing them together. I think what they're trying to do is trying to say that, you know, because Batman was monitoring them, this is why they all kind of came together, you know, and he's there, he's there as he also gets, you know, he also gets fucked up too. It's not just it's not just his his um you know his contingency plans against the Justice League, he gets fucked up himself. So I just think that at the end they kind of need to come together to beat the bigger, the bigger bad, right?
SPEAKER_01So, anyways, Batman um yeah, has this satellite spy system and he uses it to spy on these other uh meta-humans and and he leaves to go to uh birthday party, which you'll find out later uh where he goes, but and then his his satellite boots back on, like with him with him out of the room, and it gets hacked. And we jumped like right away to to the Martian Manhunter who's a detective here. Uh, I'm not really familiar with the Martian Manhunter having a detective um alter ego. Maybe I I don't read that that era of comic book.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, like he's usually in like the government of some sort.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, wasn't he like a fighter pilot too? Or am I getting someone getting?
SPEAKER_05I think you're getting him crossed with a Green Lantern, but I think so. John Jones has been a police officer, and I think he's been a detective. And yeah, I think that was pretty much his role. And then in Supergirl, they made him the head of the DEO, which is like the organization in the United States that that that that deals with context contact situations with aliens. So he's kind of worn a lot of different hats. I love Martian Manhunter, just gonna throw that out there.
SPEAKER_01But me too. I I like him in Justice League Unlimited for sure. He's got it. That's really the my only exposure to him. Yeah. Uh, but like I I think it was like a crime that he'd never made an appearance in uh in any of the uh the movies that we did actually get in the DC.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um but anyway, so so he's uh doing his detective thing. He's um he's in a crime scene, and then he finds this seahorse. Uh it's like this object, not a real seahorse, I think it's like some like Memento. And and he gets he gets laced by uh an unknown substance, and he gets set on fire. And this fire is like it doesn't it doesn't get quenched. Like it's just uh ongoing and it's uh and it's his if you guys know anything about Martian Manager, that's his greatest weakness. He can't he can't handle fire. And it's just it just lights his entire like outer layer in flames, and he uh runs out and flash and Wonder Woman uh kind of show up and subdue him and and kind of blast him with an uh an unending uh uh stream of water, and then later, like they they put him in in Wonder Woman's conservatory and he gets like the spa treatment. Yeah, the spa treatment.
SPEAKER_02Right. So yeah, there's two different versions of this. So in the Doom version, which is the animated movie, um, it's a similar poison with magnesium carbonate that inhibits his shape shifting while the magnesium fuels a never-ending fire. And Batman gives him aluminum oxide to counter that fire. That's a lot of science-y words. As someone who took a lot of science in school, I should remember how that's that's a lot more comic words.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it definitely is.
SPEAKER_02Um and in the tower, it's basically the same plan except nanites instead. And you'll see nanites really pop up a lot inside the actual um uh the movie as well. Like nanites is is the thing.
SPEAKER_05Yep, it's uh yeah, it's a new it was a new technology word that was kind of permeating across video games and and definitely in pop culture, you heard nanites kind of like all the time. I remember in Metal Gear, it was all nanites.
SPEAKER_01Like, yeah, I remember was this like solve all like words if you if you need a scientific mumbo jumbo, you say nanites. Just say nanites. Before we get into like these comparisons, I have to say Doom is overall had had my favorite contingencies. The plot in this movie, I think, was better than the plot itself in Doom, like the pacing of the movie. There's a lot of like nanites and and it's all kind of based around this scientific mumbo jumbo. Whereas in Doom, Batman really goes in depth into their psychology and fucks with them with their actual greatest weakness. But what do you guys think of this first countermeasure?
SPEAKER_05I like this one. I think this is very effective because one, John Jones is terrified of fire because his family died in fire, and fire has um a very adverse effect on Martian physiology in the obviously in the narrative of the DC universe. Fire is John Jones's biggest weakness. And the fact that they engineered it so it was coming out of his glands when he sweats. Not only was the the fire causing him fear, the fear was fueling the fire. Because when you're scared and you have it, you're at heightened anxiety, you're gonna sweat like a motherfucker. So, you know, it was basically it was almost a perpetual machine, like it it it just kept producing what was needed to kind of keep the flame going. So I think that's fucking genius.
SPEAKER_01I I think right off the bat, like you could tell Batman's not pulling any punches because it's like not only it it is his like physically, like his his like body's um greatest weakness, like he also has like a psychological fear of it. Yep. And it's like like right away you you to you could tell that like this dude's not pulling any punches, he's crazy.
SPEAKER_05Batman Batman is win the mission at any cost, he does not give a fuck, man. And you know, it's been it's been that way with him in almost every every narrative, almost every iteration. I think Michael Keene was a little bit more level-headed than the rest of the Batmans, and I don't think George Clooney and Val Kilmer ever really came up against anything. George Clooney. Yeah, you know what I mean. And and Schumacher. That never happened. Yeah, I know you're right. You're right. Nipples? Bat nipples, bat nipples, bat nipples. Yeah, but but I think that this iteration, especially the comic iteration of Batman, is is is one ruthless motherfucker. Like he like he like he's not fucking around, dude. Like if you're his target, beware.
SPEAKER_01Beware, dude. Yeah, so um, anyways, so uh Superman uh finally arrives on scene and kind of helps them subdue uh Martian Manhunter, and then for some reason the uh this is weird to me because nowhere in the script do they say that the seahorse means anything, but Superman sees it as a clue that Aquaman Aquaman might be involved. So he goes to seek out Aquaman, uh, and then you find out it was. Actually, just a plot device to get applemented to the story.
SPEAKER_02That's so random. It's like you find like a seahorse stuffy and you're like, oh, okay. That's odd. Yeah, like that's that's like if you were to find like a like a little bat toy and you're like, this is Batman. This is him. That's odd.
SPEAKER_03Okay, yeah. No, I was just gonna say uh the materials in the comic book version and the Doom version, they're a lot easier to obtain. So magnesium carbonate is a supplement, and you can buy it like a health supplement. You could buy it on Amazon, and uh aluminum oxide is something that's used. Uh you could buy it at the hardware store. I don't know really what it's used for, but uh yeah, it's available at Lowe's and Home Depot.
SPEAKER_02So you would just have to go to like Home Deeper or Lowe's and just take Martian Man in our house. Damn just that.
SPEAKER_03Martian Manager just said so weak now.
SPEAKER_01Damn.
SPEAKER_03So it would look it would look a lot less suspicious too if like Batman got those materials like if he got his redoing the back cave, he was doing some renovations, and you know, just in case anyone's watching him too, like the police, which they're no Batman isn't going to Home Depot, he's sending Alfred.
SPEAKER_05Alfred's going to Home Depot.
SPEAKER_01No, he'll buy Home Depot and then get it shipped to his house.
SPEAKER_05That's true too. That's true too. Yeah, yeah. No, uh Christina makes a good point because I remember in the comic book, it was a lot more simplified. Footnote on the JLA series from from from uh from Grant Morrison, it's like they had a team of physicists sitting down with them writing this, writing this run of JLA. It's fucking crazy, dude. Like there are words in there I've never seen in my life. And this is supposed to be a comic book, and it's and it's they deal with so much they do, oh my god, it's it's so complex and convoluted. Like there's one mission where where I think I talked about this. There was like some sort of tumor, and the Adam has to shrink himself down and go into the tumor because the tumor is like growing its own bacteria, and the bacteria has become a civilization, and they have to go and like fight the tumor, like the people living in the tumor. It's him and and Superman. It's fucking nuts, dude. It is so crazy.
SPEAKER_01Is that in an episode of uh of uh Justice Like Unlimited, actually? You know the episode when uh when Think comes back. Well, it was like the the top of the episode, it was just like the before the episode title. Like the old-fashioned way where he shrunk down and he was like cutting cutting into them with a sword.
SPEAKER_05Yes, yeah, yeah. And I think um Sabi, you got this to look forward to. There is a similar episode in Young Justice as well, which is really cool. Oh, yeah, but it's much more emotional. Like this one in Young Justice is way more of an emotional payoff. Like it's really, it's really hard-hitting shit. It's really good.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so let's let's progress, let's move the time, the the Yeah, so Aquaman, yeah.
SPEAKER_05So Aquaman's gone, or sorry, Superman's gone to see Aquaman in uh Atlantis. That's what's happened.
SPEAKER_01Okay, and and Bruce Wayne attends the party, and um Maxwell Lord, which like it's supposed to be some twist, probably, but we all know Maxwell Lord is a is a villain, and Talia Algul uh show up and they kind of like and she kind of like flirts with him, taunts him a little bit, give gives him a gives him a kiss. Uh, and then you find out that Maxwell Lord uh is like his friend. Like he doesn't know, like it kind of shows you the establishment of this universe. Like he doesn't know yet that Maxwell Lord is like this this villain. And it's been it's mentioned that he owns this like chain of restaurants that that'll come back later, foreshadowing. Let's see what it did there. Uh so he yeah, so they established that Tali Algul and Maxwell Lord are the big bads here.
SPEAKER_05So before we move on, more into the story, because this story's good and great, but Jay Barrickal as a villain, okay? Like, I don't know about you guys, but I can't get that scene in and she's out of my league out of my head where he jizzes his pants.
SPEAKER_02Like, that's just I have not seen that book, but that's a great that's a great thing to remember him. Yeah, yeah. So if it's memorable.
SPEAKER_05So I can't get that out of my head. Like, I don't see him being a villain and jizzing in his pants all at the same time. That's just not I mean that's just not a villain thing to do, jizzing your pants, like you know.
SPEAKER_02This is the thing for me. This is a like a younger cat. So this is a younger Jesse. Yeah, because we're talking about like this is 12 years ago, yeah. So most of these people are like in their 20s, right? Like Army Hammer, early 20s, Jay Paragall, probably mid, like around that age as well. Yeah. So I wonder too, like that feel that we have, because we're kind of used to getting a Batman. Like, we've had a Christian Bale Batman who was like, you know, looked young but was like 30s, and then you have your Ben Apic and everything else. So even that, like the youngness of him and the youngness of both characters. I wonder um how that would feel as well, having them play it out. Well, you know.
SPEAKER_05Well, let's think about Jay Barrickel right now, just real quick, okay? Think about how young he looks right now, right? And then think about it in 2008. Think about how young he would be in 2008.
SPEAKER_03Okay, like I compare it to the case. I'm trying to remember what I what I know him from. He was probably announced for kids.
SPEAKER_05Yes.
SPEAKER_02He was probably announced for kids. Like that's a Canadian TV show.
SPEAKER_05I don't know.
SPEAKER_03Because I'm like, I've never seen any of these movies.
SPEAKER_05He was in Tropic Thunder. Tropic Thunder.
SPEAKER_03Oh, I've seen Fanboys. Okay, Fanboys.
SPEAKER_05Yes, he is in Fan Boys, yes. He plays uh he plays Windows. He plays Windows, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05And and and he's also he was he he was in that show called Undeclared, too, where he met Seth Rogan, right? Oh yeah, and honestly, I don't see that character as intimidating, threatening, intellectually superior.
SPEAKER_02He always does this goofy comedy, I guess as well, because he's gonna be opposite Army Hammer, who, you know, is this like tall, bit like, and I'm sure he would probably be like more jacked up for this scene as well. So like like work down everything else.
SPEAKER_05He's an alpha male, dude. He's an alpha male, hundred percent alpha male.
SPEAKER_03But he does play hiccup and how to train your drain. Yeah, he did, he does, and that's like a more serious character.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but then you don't see him. Well, here's the thing though, like these characters that kind of get aged down or or kind of um fit more of the the modern day equivalent of them. If we're comparing because the the other famous one they did was Lex Luthor when they Jesse Eisenberg. Jesse Eisenberg, right. Yeah, I like this better than the Lex Luther transformation. And I'll tell you why. Because he's not the I mean it doesn't it it kind of doesn't make sense because he owns he apparently owns a chain of restaurants and he would be really young to own that chain in it in the script itself. Like he owns I think it's called Pran Planet Krypton, which you see actually Flash eating at. Oh, so it's like a planet Hollywood, but for Krypton? Sorry, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No fucking way. Yeah, okay. So so he owns it, and it just doesn't make any sense if he was this like a young entrepreneur dude. Because he'd be Jay, how do you say his last name? Barakel. I just don't want to say I just don't want to say it wrong. Yeah, Barakel. Barakel. Yeah. Um like now would probably play this role well, but in 2008, I'm not really that sure.
SPEAKER_02Also, also think about this as well is that so Batman like leaves like whatever he's doing to go to this birthday party because they're friends, and I just also like the backstory behind their friendship, and you know, there's a lot, yeah. It's interesting. Yeah, I don't know how well that could have been. Because Maxwell Lord is going to be in the new Wonder Win woman movie. Yeah, he's being played by Pedro Pedro Pascal. Pedro Pedro Pascal, who we also know as The Mandalorian. Yep, you know, and I I guess that's kind of like the image I have, like an older guy, because he's like a businessman and everything else. Yeah, and it kind of makes more sense for, I guess, you know, Bruce Wayne to make appearance for those kind of things. Yeah. So yeah, it would be interesting.
SPEAKER_05And he was played by Peter uh Fatelli in Supergirl, the guy that was in Can't Hardly Wait.
SPEAKER_02The And Twilight.
SPEAKER_05Oh, was he? Yes, he was. Yeah, he was in Twilight. So so he was played like Maxwell Lord was played by Peter Fatelli and Supergirl. And I just don't see Jay Barrichello in the role of a villain.
SPEAKER_01Like I just can't I just can't I can see him I can't reconcile that at all. I I actually can because he's like because he's like this. Oh, I mean, spoiler alert, like he's uh you guys should you guys should know the backstory of of Maxwell Lorde. Like he's he's like this exper like he's experimented on um essentially like he's a test subject. And I can see that, definitely. Like he can put on that look. It's just uh him being that young when this movie would have came out, right? Like it just doesn't make sense for the context of the fact that he's a business owner and he owns like that. I don't understand. But Maxwell Lord being because you said before, like he he's not physically imposing. Maxwell Lord doesn't have to be, like, that's not that's not really his thing. His whole thing is like I don't have to fight you, I'll just mind control you. It's more of like this this like dude who looks like a test subject, is is pretty much what it is. Okay. Um, but I do agree that it would have been weird given his age back then. And I do want to point out that I love this actor a lot. Like I think um Tropic Thunder is one of my favorite comedy movies, and he's like he's gold in that movie.
SPEAKER_05Tropic Thunder is pretty good, pretty good.
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, so moving on to the next scene. You know, we were at that birthday party, and then it it it starts cutting to like the other superheroes. So Barry Allen, played by Adam Brody, who I think is good casting choice. We can get into this. Good choice, but I think it's a good choice.
SPEAKER_01He given his popularity back then, too.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, given his popularity, given that I had him in my diary. Um all these things added up, and also this is one thing I will say about Adam Brody. He popularized like the cute nerd boy in like pop culture, you know, in terms of like TV shows, like the OC, like his character there really did, like honestly, because like you'll see a lot of these characters in like teen shows and that's not a real nerd.
SPEAKER_05That's not a real nerd. That's what nerds look like back then.
SPEAKER_02Come on, no, but no, like I would say the TV nerd, because like he played Dynasty Warriors, he read like comic books all the time, he was a comic book artist in the TV show. He also like was, you know, listened to like Death Cat for Cutie, like you know what I mean? Like they kind of created this character for him. Anyway, we can that's that's our other podcast where we talk about the OC for an hour. But anyway, so Barry Allen, he's returning home and meets up with Wally West, who is his nephew and who's played by the late Anton Yalchin, who again is amazing, really an amazing actor. Rest in peace. Um, and to research what's going on with everything. Then it cuts back to Batman. I guess he's at the birthday party, and he's fighting a biker gang and gets lured into a theater where one of the bikers transforms into an OMAC, which is basically this like cyborg, like human voice creature if you don't um and they nearly kill Batman. Yeah, nearly kills him, only to be ordered remotely to stop by Maxwell Lord Lord and Talial Gulf. Um, and they're revealed to be the ones that hacked Brother Eye. So does Batman know that they're the ones who called it off? Like, does he would he know at this point?
SPEAKER_01It it just like it just cuts to them uh uh uh Maxwell telling the old Mac to stop. Uh he doesn't know anything. He doesn't even know Brother Eye has been hacked at this point. He doesn't know anything. Uh so he's being be he's being played right now. So we we Oh come on Batman Morcer C so we get uh introduced to Green Lantern, which which in this rendition, it's actually it's actually pretty funny because uh in this rendition is is Jon Stewart and in Doom it's Hal Jordan and in uh in Tower of Babbles Kyle Rayner. So it's actually like three different three different versions of him. Which is cool to see. Yeah, so uh John Stewart, who's still an architect here, because if you guys know like they retcon his his backstory to be um uh marine, I think. But this is back in the in the good old days where uh he was still an architect and he was working on his latest project, and as he's working, he like bites his pencil and he ingests a piece of it. And then he loses and it has something in it, it's laced with something, and he loses control of his ring, and his own ring renders him blind and he loses control of it and he destroys his own office. And and I can just see this like epic scene where he's just he's like his constructs are destroying his office, and then Superman and Flash have to go in there and subdue him. And in Doom, I just want to get to Doom really fast because this is my favorite contingency, and this is kind of why I like Doom way better than I like the other ones. In in Doom, which is Hal Jordan, he gets lured into a mine because uh star I think Star Star Sapphire was um set up a farce that there was these hostages, these miners that were that were being held hostage by her. So he goes to save them, and then um he gets he gets hit, like she hits him with the scarecrow gas, which I think is ingenious for Batman to use uh his own villains weapons against his own his own guys. And and after he gets hit by the the fear toxin, she fakes the death of all of the hostages. So essentially he he thinks he failed, uh, and then breaks his will, and he just like he just gives up on everything, and he just gives up on on his uh on being the Green Lantern, and he just like stays in the in the tunnel and waits for it to collapse on him. Which I think is like the superior plan. I think so too. Uh yeah. And in in tower, you Frankie wanna take the the Tower of Babel?
SPEAKER_05Sure, sure. So uh basically what happens to the Kyle Rayner is very similar to what happens to Jon Stewart and in the movie in this version of the movie. So in Tower, Rayner is also rendered blind by his own ring, but it's from a post-hypnotic suggestion placed on him during REM sleep. And as an artist, Kyle is more crippled by being blind than I think anybody else would be. You know, it basically cuts his legs out from under him, and he doesn't know what to do, and he's just he's kind of a sitting duck, you know. He really doesn't have any way of fighting back or remedying remedying his situation.
SPEAKER_01So he has to get feels weird because that means somebody snuck into his room, could have killed him or something, yeah, but instead just like gives him a post a post-hypnotic suggestion. That that one's the weirdest one for me.
SPEAKER_05Well, in the comic book, it's Raz Al Ghoul, right? So and Raz Oh yeah, he wouldn't necessarily want to kill them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, he wouldn't want to kill him. He just wants to fuck with Batman, right? Like he wants to fuck with the Dark Knight. Like he he doesn't like he respects Batman, but he doesn't he doesn't like he he has issues with Batman. Like Batman won't take over, you know, for him as the demon's head. Batman wouldn't give his uh give his daughter a baby. She had to steal it from him, she had to steal his sperm. He just he doesn't dig him.
SPEAKER_02Which is a weird, a weird app for a dad, let me tell you. I could never get around that. That's also a weird thing.
SPEAKER_05I mean for the team, bro. It's all good. Yeah, have you seen tell have you seen Tell Yellow Ghoul? What are you doing, dude? Shit.
SPEAKER_02Um, I will say the Green Lantern, like the Jon Stewart one that happens, which is happening in the movie, the biting of the pencil. I somewhat like it's almost a little comical, just like thinking about it. It's like it's also a bad habit. It's like, you know, when people bite their nails, they put stuff on it's like this will make him never bite a pencil. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05For sure.
SPEAKER_02But right, doesn't it seem like I know that the actual scene would play out in a different way, but just like him chewing on his pencil somehow, and like the lead getting like just the process of it, I would would have to be shot in a way that I mean everything has to be shot in a way.
SPEAKER_01I find weird that in the script, ev almost every contingency is kind of like encumbered on a type of poison. Like it's it's like almost every one of them is like Batman poisoning them and getting like a substance in them or or a nanite in them. Whereas in Doom, it's actually like ingenious how he plays with people's previous fears, and it doesn't always have to do with like poisoning them, which is like I don't know. Yeah, I think it's more creative.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, Chris, sorry, no, you make a good point, dude. I think in Doom it's a lot more, you know, it's a lot yeah, it's a lot more personal, but it's also a lot more snares and levers and actual physical things being done to them, you know? Yeah, um, like what he does to the flash in Doom is actually quite ingenious, and the way that he has to get rid of it, right, is also very physical thing. So it's you know, it's definitely very different. But before we move on, let's talk about let's talk about Kalman as Jon Stewart, okay? And the reason I want to talk about Kalman as Jon Stewart is because Phil Lamar, the voice actor, he plays Jon Stewart in Justice League, uh Unlimited in the Justice League, right? And Jon Stewart is always the smoothest motherfucker ever. Like he sounds like Chef from South Park. Like that's what he's like. Like he's got this low kind of baritone, like, you know, almost like fucking shaft. You know what I mean? Like he's almost how you expect shaft to sound in a cartoon. And I feel like common would almost be the same way. He'd just be like this fucking smooth, you know, slick, like you know, super player type. Yeah, exactly. He'd be the player.
SPEAKER_01The other Green Lantern. That's why I likes Jon Stewart. Like Hal Jordan's will always be making my Green Lantern, but Jon Stewart's like a very close second. Actually, uh for a long time I liked him better than Hal because just League Unlimited is the best. Um what I like about him is that he's the only serious Green Lantern. Everybody else are like goofballs, and I think Kamen would would encapsulate that a lot. You know what I mean? Like he's not only he's the most in control Green Lantern there is, right? Yeah, no, he's definitely lead back.
SPEAKER_02I do like the idea of Common as as as him, but in terms of like the I guess because if we're looking at like just the Gun Limit, like the the the you know, the animated show, the guy who plays Dig on um, yes, yes, John Diggle, yeah. Yeah, I always thought he had like he looked like him from like the cartoon. Yep, you know what I mean? Um but I think you're right, like Common. Yeah. Yeah, like he just has that look. But I yeah, I have nothing. I I mean I have nothing at Common. He he's very like you said, very smooth. I mean, I haven't felt him or anything. That's weird.
SPEAKER_05Damn Sabu, you're starting to like show yourself a lot, eh?
SPEAKER_02Like well, because I really enunciated smooth, I thought.
SPEAKER_05I was gonna ask you what happened, uh I was gonna ask you happen what what happened in Shazam when Adam Brody turned or sorry, when Freddie turned into Adam Brody. I wanted to I wanted to get your take on that.
SPEAKER_02I mean, I just I really I will always love Adam Brody. There's a special part of my heart that like preteen subba that will always like claiming you never forget your first hearthrop.
SPEAKER_05Hilarious. Okay, so uh Aquaman gets stung by a robot mosquito with a fear nanite that gives him aquaphobia. Genius! Yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_02Like, how can it how do you do that? How is that done?
SPEAKER_05I don't know, especially when you're the king of Atlantis.
SPEAKER_01That's a big leap that that somebody can make up robot mosquito. That's it.
SPEAKER_02You could give the fear nanite to like everybody. Like, that's a pretty like catch-all one. That is a pretty good catch-all.
SPEAKER_01Give it a f a death nanite. Why are you going fear nanite? A death a death nanite.
SPEAKER_05Um, here's my question about the Aquaman contingency, especially in this movie. Did the robot mosquito swim underwater to Atlantis to sting him?
SPEAKER_01Oh, I'm sorry. Uh I I didn't put put this in the notes, but um uh when Soup's goes to um to get him, he he goes on this tirade about about like how humans are polluting his water. Oh, the surface world and then and then he like reluctantly goes. Oh yeah, this is actually a pretty big point. Oh I'll I dropped the ball on this one, guys. Um he reluctantly goes with with Superman because he says because of her, and then in brackets in in the uh in the script notes, it says in brackets Wonder Woman. So him and Wonder Woman apparently had a thing. I just didn't add it because it literally is only that one scene, and it never gets mentioned again. Okay. So it essentially Superman uses Wonder Woman against Aquaman. That's how that's why he goes to help.
SPEAKER_05So uh going back to Aquaman real quick, this is being played by Santiago Cabrera, and Santiago Cabrera was um in Heroes. He played the artist, Isaac. Isaac, yes, he played the artist, he's the guy that had to be all cranked out on on heroin to tell the future with his with his paintings. Um amazing character, one of the best characters in heroes, without a doubt. And I could definitely see him being Aquaman. He's you know, he definitely has a darker kind of vibe to him than say the Aquaman that we've gotten up until this point. Even in Justice League Unlimited, the Justice League Unlimited looks more like um, you know, he'd be on a you'd be on a tour bus for like, you know, for Whitesnake or something, not really the king of Atlantis. Okay. Did it did everybody get my 1980s rock reference there? Because I know that some of you guys are are a little young for that, but no? Okay, anyways. I hate when this happens.
SPEAKER_03I know who the rock is.
SPEAKER_05No, I said rock group, white snake.
SPEAKER_03Oh, rock group, okay.
SPEAKER_05White snake. No, not snakes, white snake. White snake. Oh, yeah, I never heard of that band. No, I don't know who the snake is. So, anyways, so so the Aquaman Justice League Unlimited is like a blonde, he's got long blonde hair. Like he looks like a like he looks like a rocker, right? And Santiago Cabrera is definitely he looks he looks Latino. And I think Jason Mamoa could definitely pass for Latino if he wanted to. So I kind of like this direction. And from what I've seen from the costuming, his costuming was very similar to what Jason Momoa was rocking in um in the Justice League film that we got in 2017. Um, hashtag Snydercut. And I really like that. And also the other thing I really like about this is Aquaman had his water bearer hand in this movie. That's fucking cool as shit. Like, I want to see the water bearing magic when I see Aquaman characters or I see Atlanteans. Like funny you say that.
SPEAKER_01After he gets stung by the fear nanite, he rips it off because it's made out of water. Oh, really? Does he really rips it off? Yeah, he rips it off and throws it, and then Martian the Martian gets a hold of it and realizes if he puts it on his body, it turns into a water water armor, which stops him from bursting into flames. What the fuck? Such a weird scene. That is so complicated.
SPEAKER_03Also, with respect to the fear nanite, I I also read somewhere that uh it was an altered form of Scarecrow's fear toxin. So that's like what's in it. So there is like a chemical thing to it. It's not just like like the nanite is just the delivery. Yeah, of course.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, no, no, no. Yeah, Batman is uh Batman's um, you know, digging into his bag of tricks from his rogues gallery.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, that that's hilarious. He rips off his water hand. That's that's that's weird. Yeah. So they later use the power of Green Lantern with the telepathic guidance of the Martian to surgically remove the nanite. Okay. The power of the Green Lantern with the Okay. Aquaman wasn't in the other versions. Oh, right. He wasn't in the other versions.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, like this is the only version that he was in here.
SPEAKER_05Yeah. Actually, no wait.
SPEAKER_01Was he in tower? Yeah, he was in tower. My research didn't show up.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, he was definitely in tower because they had to put him in um they had to put him in a water tank.
SPEAKER_01Alright, so that's a good portion of the league out of the way. Um we will make us a two-parter, so we have a lot of of um league beat ups left. Uh but yeah, so we'll we're gonna end it off here. But before we go, I I would like to thank you guys for your for your listens uh and your support. We really love making this this content for you. If you could uh take the time and uh review us, please, on Apple Podcasts, Pod Chaser, and Stitcher, that would really help us out. And also, like we want to hear what you guys think. Like, if you like these sort of episodes, do you like this series? I think that'll do it for this uh part one of this breakdown. Please stay tuned for part two. Uh yeah, so this has been Fitzavana, Christina Dickema, I'm here, and Frank McGuire. Later, dude.
